Monday, October 13, 2008

Charles Darwin Vs. Sarah Palin

Many on the left have criticized Governor Sarah Palin for her views on origins.  Governor Palin is a woman of faith and so bases her cosmology on certain presuppositions traditionally held by Christians.  Some celebrities have been critical of her claim that humans were co extant with dinosaurs.  Perhaps Hollywood celebrities would do well to remember that they are, for the most part, clowns, whose professional purpose is to amuse (as did the court jesters of old) and nothing more.  

All of us, Christian or not, function from a set of presuppositions (basic truths which we hold to be self evident).  And, all of our presuppositions are based on faith.   The evolutionist has a different set of faith based presuppositions as compared to the creationist.  But, in the end, all systems rely on taking something for granted in faith.  Before you criticize Governor Palin too quickly, perhaps you should closely examine the prevailing theory of origins: evolution, espoused by Charles Darwin.  In broad terms, the theory of evolution posits that, through the mechanism of natural selection, one species evolves into another and so on in an inexorable process.  This process of natural selection should produce plant, animal, and insect forms of an innumerable variety.  Inadequate forms, with their unsuccessful mutations,  should be locked in the fossil record.  Here is where evolution meets with the unanswerable question of paucity in the fossil record.  For the sake of argument, let's admit archeopteryx and the smattering of other supposed intermediate forms "discovered" in fossil form.  For evolution to be viable, there would have to be millions upon millions of intermediate forms littering the fossil record.  No such body of evidence exists.  The great edifice of evolution stands on the foundation of the transformation of species into more advanced forms.  Here, the monolithic structure cracks and falls before a cursory review of its observable predictions.  Evolution is more about providing a salve for conscience than about accurately describing and predicting natural phenomena.  It is a faith for those who would deny Deity, nothing more.  

Governor Palin is criticized for holding a view of nature consistent with the Biblical description of creation; a view supported by rational observation.  In fact, the Biblically based presuppositions are the only truths upon which rationality can be based or upon which science can function.  Apart from the assumption that God is and that He has spoken in His word, there can be no rational theory of knowledge. Therefore, it is ironic that Governor Palin is attacked by persons who subscribe to a patently irrational ontology.  What are their presuppositions? That out of nothing arises something?  That from chaos springs order?  That from the womb of the inanimate life is born?  Accepted science once told us that the world was flat.  Who then is naive?  

Governor Palin has consistently demonstrated a strength of character born of conviction.  She possesses, in full measure, that essential quality of leadership: Christian character.  She is enabled by the magnanimity of her own religious tradition to embrace those of differing faiths, just as our founding fathers were inspired to provide for a free republic, open to the world's tired and huddling masses.  If Hollywood would criticize Governor Palin for her faith, then they disparage the American tradition that shelters all of us under the banner of freedom.  Sarah Palin's left-wing critics ally themselves with the religiously bigoted and politically fascist.    

"Religion is as necessary to reason, as reason is to religion.  The one cannot exist without the other.  A reasoning being would lose his reason, in attempting to account for the great phenomena of nature, had he not a Supreme Being to refer to."  George Washington

31 comments:

WRG said...

I really don't understand why you're so worried about Osama bin Laden and the Taliban. From a theological point of view, you're exactly on the same page.

Shpiegie said...

First, Wikipedia on Fossils: Fossilization is an exceptionally rare occurrence, because most components of formerly-living things tend to decompose relatively quickly following death. In order for an organism to be fossilized, the remains normally need to be covered by sediment as soon as possible. However there are exceptions to this, such as if an organism becomes frozen, desiccated, or comes to rest in an anoxic (oxygen-free) environment.

Second, evolution has been seen on the microorganism level time and time again in science labs. If you ever took intro to bio in college, you would do a yeast lab based solely on evolution by irradiating the yeast and having the yeast grow on insufficient media to exist.

The problem with people who believe in religion predominantly is that when they attack science, they do not attack in a scientific way. They state their presumed beliefs about science without truly looking at the underlying causes for theories (a theory is NOT in fact like a hypothesis. Theories are proven over and over again in labs, but have not been around long enough to become a law).

People have varying beliefs. America is a land of many of these beliefs. Science can be proven and religion requires faith. Science should be taught in schools and religion should only be taught in places of religious faith, such as churches, temples, and mosques.

People who believe in faith usually base their vote on faith rather than the economic values that their family needs to survive. Separate church and state, please.

wildlifer5 said...

So many errors, so little time.

Evolution is about the origins of species, not life.
Darwin credited that, to a creator.

Evolution is a fact as is evident from the hundreds of transitionals we do have, to the biggest transitional find to date - DNA.

Darwin could not have hoped for a better find. Nor did he predict, nor expect "millions upon millions of intermediate forms littering the fossil record" as only one ignorant of both fossilization and geological processes would make such a claim.

Even though we scientists still muddle through in an attempt to complete the Theory of Evolution on how evolution occurred.

Evolution does not posit a direction to "more advanced" forms. It posits species will be well adapted to their niches, eg blind cave fish. Bacteria are the most successful species known in the universe, capable of surviving even in space and temperatures at all extremes, are they “more advanced”? Not an objective term and is entirely subjective.

Evolution does not posit there will be a real-time sharp division between what a species is, and what a species was. A species is not one thing today and something else tomorrow.

Evolution vs creationism is not a left vs right issue, nor is it a religious vs non-religious issue. Conservative Christians or even Conservatives and Christians accept Evolution and the Theory of Evolution as the most parsimonious explanation for the diversity of life.

This is a sectarian squabble.

There is no scientific theory of creationism or in its latest incarnation "intelligent design" so it's preposterous to demand they be taught in science class.

However, it would in my mind be perfectly acceptable to teach in a comparative origins class in which all 500 some-odd origins beliefs would be examined.

Lastly, the Flintstones is not a docu-drama man did not exist with dinosaurs, not even when he was living in caves.

JesseTaraMcCoyandgang said...

Good blog! Agree with ya! I'm proud to know that I didn't come from some accident, but that God wanted me and wanted my fellowship. It makes me way above animals! I love that man was made in the image of God. And that God cared enough to form man with HIS hands.

Mark said...

Uh, no such 'body of evidence' exists for your Christian beliefs, either, so that would disqualify your religion on the same grounds that you have disqualified evolution.

When it comes down to it, you can't be certain of anything and to believe that you are is just sheer stupidity. Your beliefs are baseless, your support of Palin and her insane ideologies is blind and at the end of the day, zealots like yourself are the ones running the world into the ground.

Tell me -- what evidence do you have that the bible is the word of 'God' and a work of fiction? How can you be pro-life yet support an agenda that is completely warmongering? Religion has been the largest cause of death and war on this planet, and I think by those grounds I will disqualify your beliefs as moronic and ignorant and go as far to say that you are no better than Osama Bin Laden.

Jaggie Gold said...

"Perhaps Hollywood celebrities would do well to remember that they are, for the most part, clowns, whose professional purpose is to amuse (as did the court jesters of old) and nothing more."
It rather amuses me that you portray yourself as a Christian and are so judgmental on others. I think it's called self-righteousness, no? Or do you, yourself, call it something else?
And while we're on the same topic - you oppose abortion but at the same time you openly encourage war in a ravaged country who didn't even attack the US. Do their lives not matter at all to you? Christianity is based on the presumption that all human being are equal, but you still advocate aggression and discrimination. Your hypocrisy goes a long way.

John said...

Hmm, Darwin originally credited a "Creator" in his theory (read educated guess) but later in life professed a thorough atheism. Evolutionism in it's modern form is all encompassing: touching upon social and political theory. Any honest critic must admit this. Advanced, more successful: an honest understanding of the theory is that species become more advanced or higher in order as natural selection promulgates only the successful mutations, e.g. the monkey to a man delusion. Or, perhaps you don't feel that men are more advanced or complex than monkeys. Given the mind-boggling chronology of evolution the fossil record should be replete with examples. There are none. Deny it as much as you like, rational people find this to be conclusive. Evolution is a tired old hope, well worn, and discredited. Evolution is atheistic, creationism is theistic. Therefore, it is a left v. right issue. Hopefully, there are more informed and intellectually acute people out there.

John said...

P.S. Since you haven't thought it through, or perhaps purposefully wish to avoid it, the point of the post is that your presuppositions are held in faith just as mine are. You are no more scientific than the metaphysical philosopher.

Tara said...

I'm sorry, but I have to stop reading this blog, I just can't stand to read the stupidity anymore of the responses that you continue to get from those who seem to be just be sitting by their computer awaiting your next blog so they can combat it. I wish you luck with you quest! Sadly I don't see eyes being opened, or the seeing it thru someone elses eyes coming around anytime soon. Just hatred. America=a majority of citizens filled with hate.

Filius de Paulus said...

"I really don't understand why you're so worried about Osama bin Laden and the Taliban. From a theological point of view, you're exactly on the same page."

This is an ignorant comment and as a Christian (Catholic) I am offended. It's one thing to not like the policies of Palin/McCain, it's another to engage in personal attacks, now I don't support Palin/McCain by any means but people like the one who posted this prop up the attack of conservatives that say all liberals are lunatics! (Not all of us are, some of us are good sane Christians, or Jews, or Muslims)

Tami: Blog Creator and Administrator said...

JimSkipper
Although I saw no real need to post your comment, I will answer your question.
If you were smart enough to read on down past the first posting, you will see that the ladies post 3 or 4 to every 1 post that John puts up--not that it's any of your business since it's my blog, I will let anyone of the writers who contribute here post as they see fit as long as the subject applies.
You libs have a lot of nerve. You come on here trying to tell me how to run my blog, demanding that you be heard---guess what? Your right to free speech applies to government, not to this blog. I am not a government entity, and you do not have the right to free speech on my personal blog. I have been most generous in letting the other side be heard. From now on, you leave a legitimate SANE argument, you MIGHT get posted and you MIGHT not...Dems, you add a website to it, you will, for sure, not be posted. I will not be an advertising agency for those who don't want to do the work to get your blog recognized as I have.
Additionally, your comment will not be posted if you come on here leaving 2 or 3 page arguments....in that case, you can open your own blog to be heard as I did. It's very easy and saves my readers the time and energy.

Tami: Blog Creator and Administrator said...

Tara,
Don't lose heart, there are still plenty of wonderful people in these United States. I still hold out hope that the MAJORITY of Americans are such--they just don't have time to sit at home trying to hijack blogs that oppose their view as the losers from the Obama camp have done. You see, they preach "free speech" as long as that speech agrees with their view...otherwise, the majority of them use whatever method necessary to silence you. It is to discourage you from voting, it is to discourage you from seeking the truth, it is to beat you down---and that is what cannot happen. Fight back, get involved, and most importantly, VOTE--but do not lose heart.
God Bless

Filius de Paulus said...

OK I will try to post this again, what I said before my second comment was posted was that it is not unChristian to think that dinosaurs and humans did not coexist. According to the Bible, we (man) are the last of our Father's Creation. Science, Reason, and Faith go hand in hand. I'm not entirely sure what evangelicals believe as I myself am a Catholic, but in my Church we are free to believe that the earth is billions of years old (I'm not saying our Church supports human evolution at all). But it would behoove the greater evangelical society not to just throw out all of philosophy and science but to use it in context. Global warming, the earth being billions of years old, even the big bang theory do not refute God's creative hand and it does not "invalidate" the Grace of God. The earth did not have to be created in exactly seven days for the Bible to be God's word, even the Bible says a day to God is like a thousand years to us. Pax!

Charity said...

Thanks so much for this blog!

I read and re-read this post because it is just so nice to hear compelling thought on this topic since so much about evolution is just beat into our heads and assumed as accepted common knowledge anymore.

If nothing else, it made be contemplate the awesomeness (if that is a word!) of life on earth and how, no matter how it came to be, it was a spectacular event/process and we are all living proof of either divine creation or miraculous serendipity.

McCain/Plain '08!!!

ruKUNFUZED said...

Who's Darwin? For those with little or no knowledge of Biblical History, the Bible has been around since, oh,...about,...I don't know,....1000 B.C.? Darwin's theory has been around since...what? mid 1800 A.D.? I think the Bible has quite of bit more historical information to go on.
Here's the thing - the truth - no one can say for certain that any one theory or belief system is true! That is, until you experience it for yourself.
For all the anti-christian commentators...I dare you to read the Bible! I mean, really read it and try to understand it. See if you were to apply certain aspects of the teachings of Jesus in your life, if your life would change. I DARE YOU! It's easy to mock, and comment on what you barely know. The only way to know Christianity is to live it...since you don't live it - don't comment on it. Funny thing is many Christians CAN comment on what life is like without knowing Jesus or without understanding Biblical principles, because we lived life without knowing Jesus, and then lived life knowing Him.
For all you 'scientificists' (as Pres. Bush may say - haha just love that about him) the information about findings changes so often, it's hard to believe the scientific explanations about anything regarding how the earth was formed.
I heard a joke once and I'd like to share:
Scientists and God met one day when scientists finally discovered how to make man from dirt. They said to God, 'We are like you now, God, because we can make man from dirt!' God looked at them and said 'Ok, that's nice. How about we each give it a go and see who makes the better human?' Just as the scientists went to pick up some dirt from the ground, God looked at them and said, 'Ah, ah, ah!!! Make your own dirt!'

patty m said...

Tami, I love your blog and read it religously. Keep up the good fight...you put into words exactly what I'm feeling as a conservative. I wish others would open their eyes to dangerous path this country is headed.

Michael O'Conner said...

Tami, you're fat ass, racist bitch with a blog. After Palin loses this election for McCain, you can go back to the white life of privilege that your husband provides for you in your white neighborhood and go back your white church and hang out with your white friends and continue to keep your kids separated from the black kids at school.

Obama now has Nevada, Colorado, FLORIDA, Virginia, West Virginia, Ohio, and, most recently, North Dakota. You almost had Pennsylvania for awhile there, but now that state is a lock for Obama. You can have piddly Missouri if you want it.

I guess a woman who attended four colleges (including a community college) in six years just to get a communications/journalism degree from the unprestigious University of Idaho was not someone who Americans as a whole wanted next in line for the highest ranking office in the land. After this election is over, Palin will have her pit bull tail between her legs when she goes back to Alaskahahahaha!

Scott said...

I continue to be surprised at the polarization and subsequent hostility from both sides of this argument... in fact, I find it hard to believe that there are actually two 'sides' to this discussion.

I just don't understand why creationism and natural selection are mutually exclusive- why isnt it conceivable (since John so rightly points out that both groups depend on a good amount of faith here) that God built our world on many perfectly designed laws, one of which is natural selection and adaptation?

Why is it so offensive to think that the Creator built a mechanism so wonderful- one that adapts beautifully over time to adjust to a changing natural environment for the good of the species and life on this planet?

And why is it also offensive for 'evolutionists' to believe that the hand of God was present in the design?

I think there's common ground on this, folks. Let's try to find it.

Tami: Blog Creator and Administrator said...

Yet another racist Democrat hurling accusations.
Hmmmm, seems to be a pattern.

Filius de Paulus said...

Tami,
Can we not place nut jobs like that with all Democrats, I am a Democrat and I have have yet to hurl a racist comment. Now, I know that sets me up for the whole McCain/Palin inciting hatred at their rallies thing but this blog doesn't necessarily incite hatred, that person is just an idiot, some of us can have intelligent debate and some people do not have the mental capacity to debate civilly (like a dog, or a skunk), democrat or republican.

Tami: Blog Creator and Administrator said...

you are right, and I have allowed many like yourself to post here....although I am sure you can imagine how old it is getting...we try to have an intelligent debate, and the FEW crazy comments you see are only a taste. Many of them tell me they do work for Obama, so I am very clear on what Obama is all about, and his intention to shut down sites such as mine.

Tami: Blog Creator and Administrator said...

and it speaks volumes to his intentions once, God forbid, he ever enter the doors of the White House as Commander in Chief.

I do, however, appreciate YOUR attempt to have an intelligent conversation. It's refreshing, even though I disagree with you.

Filius de Paulus said...

I don't think these crazies work for Obama. Just like the crazies at the McCain rallies don't work for McCain, that's giving crazy people way too much credit. I bet it's just some odd balls sitting at home waiting for the next disagreement to pounce on, I'm in college so I'm allowed to sit around and do nothing (lol). But yea, I bet it's just a bunch of crazies that give themselves way too much credit, I doubt either camp would allow these ignorants to roam around their offices.

Tami: Blog Creator and Administrator said...

You are right, I am sure many of them are just as you describe. However, we have confirmed that some ARE Obama supporters that HAVE been instructed to hijack this and other sites like it.

I have given them a voice here for too many days--in an attempt to expose them for what they are. We have done that effectively, and they will not have that voice on this site any longer.

Have a great day all!!

wildlifer5 said...

John,
Evolution is accepted by atheists, that's true enough. There are also atheists who do not accept evolution. But the vast majority of persons who accept evolution are theists.
The majority of my conservative friends accept evolution and most, but not all, of them are theists.
Again, it's a sectarian issue.

And no, the theory does not state species become "more advanced" as that criteria is far too subjective. More advanced for what? Living in the trees? Living in and next to deep ocean thermal vents? Living as solitary hunters? As grazers?

We did not evolve from a monkey. We are apes as are our cousins the chimpanzees and gorillas. As were our common ancestors. The DNA evidence for this is emphatic. The shared errors, the shared endogenous retroviruses... et al. (Evidence which blows the common design argument right out of the water.)

The surface of this planet is not static, so why one would expect millions and millions of fossils is beyond me. Google Plate subduction.

As the science and the theory have progressed scientists are becoming better at making predictions and testing them.
Not too long ago, a few of them made a prediction that a tetrapod transitional should be found in the late Devonian, so they went looking and discovered Tiktaalik.

But again, the greatest transitional discovery was DNA.

And no, I have no faith in the fact of evolution nor the Theory of Evolution.
There are thousands of data points which show the fact of evolution.
The Theory of Evolution, how it occurred, could change tomorrow and it would not change the fact it did indeed occur. Any such change will be evaluated by how it addresses the evidence.

So no, no presuppositions here.
None of this addresses whether or not God exists, it just exposes one sectarian view of God as in error.

The Wood Man said...

K my first problem with this post is that it immediately attacks any non-traditional Theists. It is great that you believe as strongly as you do, but do the rest of us a favor and remember that you are a minority in the world. You are not the majority opinion. Not even in America. And Palin has been proven to have abused her powers as a Governor. Im not Dem, but I'm not republican either. So don't just think I'm some leftist nut job. But i do see large flaws in the reasoning for this post, as well as the bad support it would lead to Palin if you truly wanted to support her. Bringing up her beliefs is not pertinent. It doesn't matter if she believes in Evolution or Creationism. So long as she remembers the separation of church and state, she should be just fine. As for her abuses, well, she went about things wrong, but that doesn't mean i think she's actually qualified for the job. And that has nothing to do with her being a woman, or a theist. It has everything to do with how she answers questions, her knowledge base, and her inability to come up with reasons for her actions.

A vote for McCain is a vote for Palin as president. McCain won't Last through his term if elected. Thats the plan id say. Since Palin is the continuation of the Bush Regime. A friendly face to destroy the constitution.

BTW do your candidates even Know where Spain is without an adviser???

Tami: Blog Creator and Administrator said...

LOL

So now you claim to be God, since YOU and most Democrats claim to KNOW John McCain will be dead within 4 years? Do you, like some have advocated here, plan to see to it that that happens? That's the only thing I can assume since you all seem to be so sure he will die if elected!

Christina said...

Tami...

I was contacted by a friend of mine the other day. He said that people are "hired" to search out "high-profile sites". Their specific jobs are to scare people into NOT voting and "take-over" or even "shut-down" sites. I had no idea that this was going on. But, with everything that has happended over here (especially since being aired on CNN), I say it's high time to "shut them up" and stop them from going any further. Besides, I have really had enough of their uneducated-trash-talking-vile remarks.
Good choice...
Pressing On,
Christina

P.S. This doesn't go for all... I know that there are well-minded and polite liberals who want to speak and they do so politely. (Kudos to them. You know who you are.) So please take my apology if my comment has come on as very harsh. You just have no idea what this site and the people here have been through. You have not lived in my email box and read such horrible, evil talk. -C

John said...

In addition to what Tami said, wood man, you would do well to take note of your own candidates' lack of knowledge pertaining to much of anything regarding foreign policy...or within our borders, such as how many states we have...or who was President during the depression, or when television was invented.

John said...

Christina--

Yes, that is what we heard too, and it has been confirmed by comments left here that we have chosen not to publish. It's something really--that Obama's camp would hire people to bully those exercising their freedom of speech. It's very telling, indeed.

That is why we, from now on, will publish only a select few of the comments left here by liberals. We have given them plenty enough rope to hang themselves, and they have done so brilliantly.

Postergirl said...

Hi Tami,
Just an honest and curious question (because I'm trying to understand those who have views different than mine): Regarding Sarah Palin, other than your agreement with her views on abortion, evolution, church and state, what are the other reasons you see her as a good candidate for Vice President? I guess I'm asking for your opinion on what about her education, knowledge and involvement (vs. experience) on foreign policy, national policies, domestic and international economics (especially in what we and the world are facing now economically)makes you support her for the #2 (and possibly #1) spot?

And, if you put aside the religious/abortion/family values issues, is there someone who you would have liked to have see as McCain's running mate instead of Palin?
Thank you,
Silou